Originally Posted By: sinij
Originally Posted By: Derid

Sinij, those socialist countries you mention function in that way because they basically act as a corporation that buys health care from USA private corporations. It goes back to the export thing. If they had to do all the R & D, and cover all the structural costs there is no way that ratio would hold water.


Why are we going in circles? How many times and in how many threads do I need to address these talking points?

R&D is done everywhere, sure US does more of it in absolute numbers, but this is because US economy is larger. Plus, unless this is academia-based research (and it won't be part of health care expenses, instead it would be under education) results and fruits of this research are not just given away, they are SOLD FOR A PROFIT to these countries.

Your "R&D" argument is not logical, unless you are suggesting US does disproportionally more failed R&D (or one that only applicable to USA) than any other country and this failed research adds to health care costs.


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The core problem with your arguments sinij, if you only use the data that fits your scenario and ignore things that do not.


The core problem with your arguments is that you base them on your brand of conservatism that at its core has a faith-based worldview. Any facts or data I present are outright dismissed as "selective", yet anything supporting your point of view is seen as a paragon of integrity. I have yet to see such extreme selective reading outside of political debates.


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Stop cherry-picking your stats in a manner that amounts to outright twisting of the truth, and examine the entire reality, and you will not be able to defend their policies.


So what you believe is "the truth" and "entire reality" but what I say is "twisting of the truth". How can we have a factual argument when you show such open bias?




You try and say I do not understand the concept of normalization when you do not understand the concept that 200 countries importing USA drugs, treatments and tech results in the USA getting a larger health care industry as % of GDP.

Or are you talking about consumer level spending?

In which case you are ignoring that a foreign country that buys as a bloc essentially as a single buyer and is able to get considerable discounts as they are a secondary market.

You are also ignoring the extreme cases of advanced medicine where the costs of a few procedures/treatments , the retail value is exceedingly high and skew the overall results.

You also havent faced up to the bulk of rebuttals presented.

Also, I wouldnt say someones economics is somehow faith based when you do not even understand the basic concepts of how pricing and economic valuation are reached in the first place.

I had suggested breaking off to a new thread earlier so that the argument could be refocused with clarity, but it appears you want to keep dodging rebuttals and throwing out inconsistent sources. Being inconsistent and unclear and jumping back and forth between arguments may make it hard to pin you down on every independent point, but it doesnt make you right.

For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)