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By a retired cop.

Of all the states that now have concealed carry in high volumes, the story that comes out of one person acting like lefties were afraid of.. turns out its actually a retired agent of the State who spent his adult life lording over people with his badge and gun.

My reaction only comes across as strange to the extremely intellectually dishonest.


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Retired cop is not on duty or off duty, it is a civilian and a poster child for NRA "good guys with guns".

I am sure you will rationalize it all away with some weird conclusion how more guns would have made this situation better.

This issue has nothing to do with police brutality or "agent of the State".


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Such willful ignorance in pursuit of disarming a citizenry is utterly appalling.

You dont think a lifetime of impunity when using force to lord over people as an armed agent of the State had anything to do with this guys decision to just up and shoot someone who pissed him off? Ex Swat member at that apparently.

You lefties spend so much time talking about how environment tends to mold worldview and behavior, then it all flies out the window the second its politically inconvenient. How typical.


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Originally Posted By: Derid

You dont think a lifetime of impunity when using force to lord over people as an armed agent of the State had anything to do with this guys decision to just up and shoot someone who pissed him off?


No I think Alzy visited old geezer couple years back and in that instance something shorted in his head particularly hard.

More nutters with guns cheered on by gun nuts.


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Originally Posted By: Derid

You lefties spend so much time talking about how environment tends to mold worldview and behavior, then it all flies out the window the second its politically inconvenient. How typical.


You just sold your "you generalize too much" argument down the river. Who is "you lefties"? It just me in this thread.

What does "environment trends" have to do with anything? Are you just randomly blowing dog whistles in hopes that "the cavalry" going to rescue you from your intellectually bankrupt corner?

If you are here to just troll, Ron Paul thread is that way ---->


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"Environment tends" not trends. Have you, or have you not stated in the past that a persons environment and circumstances plays a large role in their worldview and behavior?

We both know the answer to this, just like we both know you were trolling in the first place.

Because, increased citizen carry has coincided with a decrease in violent crime overall. So at very best, your little "heres an armed society" comment was seizing on a statistical outlier at best which you also undoubtedly were aware of when you posted it.

Troll.


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Yes, circumstance play a role in forming worldview, but I do not agree with your irrational "fuck the police" view. Anything that flows from it is your typical attempt to re-frame the argument.

I personally don't think police are the nicest people, but claiming that "ex-cop" is necessary and sufficient explanation for the incident is not a credible argument.


Still, during this argument you implied two unsupported claims:

a) increased carry somehow connected with a decrease in violent crime

b) lifetime of police service somehow makes you more prone to violence

I want you try reconcile these in case of concealed carry by a retired cop.


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http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/15/justice/florida-movie-theater-shooting

So apparently the guy had been going around intimidating other people. Seems to me like a cop who couldnt quit being a cop after he retired.

as for your points

a) I did not try to make a positive correlation here between increased carry and decrease, but rather that prior of assertions of other parties in the past that claimed increased carry would result in a drastic increase in violence as a result have obviously not panned out.

b) Probably more accurate to say a lifetime of police service, particularly in SWAT type units makes you more prone to being a bully and having a sense of impunity. In this case that led to violence, but usually probably does not.

The takeaway was that even in a society where peons are disarmed, this guy would still have been armed and this guy still would have felt entitled to harass and intimidate people.

It is an effect being a police officer has on many people. No, it is not something that every police officer becomes. Just like some people who drink become alcoholics, but most people are fine. Some people who spend their life as a cop become this guy.


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Originally Posted By: Derid

The takeaway was that even in a society where peons are disarmed, this guy would still have been armed.


First, you are trying to dog whistle here "society where peons are disarmed". Eyeroll.

Second, you have difficulty understanding that the shooter in no way was part of establishment (government men with guns). He was a private citizen with a concealed carry.

So any limitation to private gun ownership would have also limited perpetrator's access to guns.

Now question you really should be asking where I would have trouble answering is what kind of gun ownership limitation would have prevented this situation.

Instead you chose to dogwhistle and throw red meat. Eyeroll.

Still, of all kinds of innocent victims, the movie texter is the least innocent kind.


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Incorrect as usual.

First, dog whistle for what/whom? I just answered your troll with something that I admittedly knew you would make incorrect assumptions on and run wild with.

Second I have no difficulty understanding that he was retired and no longer active - you just keep bringing it up even though it is irrelevant to the point (as usual)

Third, no private limitations on ownership would likely have had zero effect unless you also assume 1) no exceptions are allowed for those affiliated/retired from service , which is unlikely - and 2) that police departments would cross the "Blue line" and start forcibly searching the person/property of their own retirees.

As usual you arent able to see the larger picture, or factor in anything that might be inconvenient to the conclusions you find socially comfortable to hold. In this case, the human element.


The correct answer with how to have prevented this.. is frankly better monitoring, and evaluation of public servants.


For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
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