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Originally Posted By: Derid

You are seriously trying to assert that the NN as currently written, encompasses and embodies all the factors that allowed the Internet to be what it is?


Yes, I have stopped beating my wife.

NN is very key to how web works. It would be AOLs all the way down otherwise, and they won't be talking to each other.


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/facepalm

So your saying that the internet came about because the govt was taking action against BBSes who didnt integrate?

Who told you that? Al Gore?


For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
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If I was Freud, I'd diagnose you with an anal fixation on government.

No, World Wide Web as we know it today exists because it was designed around and created with understanding of net neutrality. Up until mid 2000s design alone was sufficient to enforce compliance - it was too computationally intensive and cost prohibitive, but Moores law made it possible to work around the design.

Again, you are not entitled to your facts that the internet was designed to operate based on Net Neutrality principle, and FCC only had to step in recently when irresponsible corporate players decided to ignore these principles.

Framing this as a government intervention is something that crawled out of conservative fewer swamps. It isn't and there is no sane interpretation that could frame FCC actions in this light.


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Freud, like you, turned out to be mostly wrong.

You are improperly conflating things, and do not seem to understand how these things actually work or what is involved.

You dont seem to understand that the "issues" you brought up were dealt with outside the context of what is now known as "NN" , that both the FCC and other govt bodies had the power to put a halt to it without the FCC making additional power grabs.

You should read up on the history of the internet, and find out how it actually works. You might even come to understand why different ISPs link up, and you might even find out its not because some greater power told them to.

I find it funny that you try and make it seem like the FCC is codifying the way the internet always has been, then when I press you on whether they are actually doing just that - you make it seem like a loaded question.

Once again, after displaying your lack of understanding you fall back to "swamp fever" ctrl+v.

Just FYI, once you do that - I know you have at least admitted to yourself that you are probably wrong.

If you really think FCC unilaterally expanding its mandate to regulate the internet in this fashion is preferable to improved infrastructure and evening the playing field with regard to how govt interacts with telecoms and ISPs because a few blogs and Google said so - then so be it.


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You can tell when he has self-doubt, he starts insulting and slinging the republicans are evil and crazy and only watch fox news, and now has added to his list of insults to libertarians, all due to his lack of knowledge and I would assume his fear of frogs.

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Galiophobia. I had no idea.


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I have zero self-doubt on this issue, and have much more detailed understanding of underlying technologies than most people out there. Your allusions to greater understanding are amusingly transparent, but feel free to ask me questions if you want to get informed. What I am starting to do is getting annoyed at blunt fact-denying and unwillingness to consider information I present to you.

Derid, you are wrong on this issue. I have explained why, I presented examples where negative effects of your wrongness already manifested.

What I am amazed is that otherwise intelligent people like you were played like a fiddle by special interests and were convinced that black is white and Net Neutrality is government intervention into content control. There is absolutely no sane interpretation of FCC's "you may not restrict..." that would lead one to conclude they are trying to control content. Have you actually read it yourself or just relied on what others told you?

Originally Posted By: FCC
The Commission adopts three basic protections that are grounded in broadly accepted Internet norms, as well as our own prior decisions.

First, transparency: fixed and mobile broadband providers must disclose the network management practices, performance characteristics, and commercial terms of their broadband services. Second, no blocking: fixed broadband providers may not block lawful content, applications, services, or non-harmful devices; mobile broadband providers may not block lawful Web sites, or block applications that compete with their voice or video telephony services. Third, no unreasonable discrimination: fixed broadband providers may not unreasonably discriminate in transmitting lawful network traffic.

The Internet's openness is supported by an ``end-to-end'' network architecture that was formulated and debated in standard-setting organizations and foundational documents.

See, e.g., WCB Letter 12/10/10, Attach. at 17-29, Vinton G. Cerf & Robert E. Kahn, A Protocol for Packet Network Interconnection, COM-22 IEEE Transactions of Commc'ns Tech. 637-48 (1974); WCB Letter 12/10/10, Attach. at 30-39, J.H. Saltzer et al., End to End Arguments in System Design, Second Int'l Conf. on Distributed Computing Systems, 509-12 (1981); WCB Letter 12/10/10, Attach. at 49-55, B. Carpenter, Internet Engineering Task Force (``IETF''), Architectural Principles of the Internet, RFC 1958, 1-8 (June 1996), http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1958.txt; Lawrence Roberts, Multiple Computer Networks and Intercomputer Communication, ACM Symposium on Operation System Principles (1967).

Under the end-to-end principle, devices in the middle of the network are not optimized for the handling of any particular application, while devices at network endpoints perform the functions necessary to support networked applications and services.

See generally WCB Letter 12/10/10, Attach. at 40-48, J. Kempf & R. Austein, IETF, The Rise of the Middle and the Future of End-to-End: Reflections on the Evolution of the Internet Architecture, RFC 3724, 1-14 (March 2004)

Last edited by sini; 05/11/13 05:49 AM.

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So, is that kinda like the last immigration bill saying that the border fence "shall be built" or this time does the legislation actually mean what it says?

Your absolute trust in the government is one of the primary things that the rest of us find so naive.


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I invite you to read it, but for lazy people I quoted relevant parts.

Originally Posted By: sini
Have you actually read it yourself ?


Derid acting strange about Net Neutrality, he opposes it out of his general disdain for government any regulation whatsoever. In this case this is a good regulation.

Don't take my word for it - just read it.


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You completely missed the point of my post and just reposted your previous point in a more condensed form. Do you even lift bro?


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