The KGB Oracle Forums General Public Discussion (SPECIAL ACCESS) KGB Political Debate Central VOTE FOR RICK PERRY!! NO SERIOUSLY!

Actually its a lot more complex than that Mithus, there are farm subsidies... but often those are subsidies NOT to grow something, strange as that sounds.

Also a lot of subsidies and incentives go for ethanol fuel. In fact the price of food has has gone WAY UP due to gov't intervention, and subsidizing ethanol. Lots of corn goes to ethanol, raising the price of animal feed and corn products.

But I am not against some farm subsidy, because I consider it a militarily needed industry. And I definitely think it should be protected by trade law, foreign food is a major danger to this country.

Anyhow, the govt does not pay for half the cost of our food... not sure where you heard that.

it´s food chain --> as one simple example corn is used to feed animals as you said to fuel and also as ingredient or part of many thing that you eat. So as general if you subsidie some of your base, everything will be more cheap, than it should be.

I also has to point, USA is not an Island, you economy is tied to global economy, before the fall of USSR and the rise of China, I think you guys didnt have any competition on the global markets that is responsible also for you superior economy.

Now with the Russia and China on the rails and even India with the services and while preaching free market you guys are facing competition. So losing jobs is a factor.

With all that was not enough, 2 wars to spend more money, and you guys expect that a guy fix all that in 3 years. He will pay the price of the global economy changing direction.

Also the new "Rome" has risen now, after the first WW2 -> to 2000 = EUA, and now China.. to an economy ascpect, becaue in terms of military you still have no match.

The reason Bush was re-relected was more because of dumbness John Kerry. If the democrats had someone that was votable, Bush may have been in trouble. If Gore didn't have a mental breakdown, he might have had a better chance than Kerry.

I think the subsidy argument was truer 15 years ago than today. After Bush pushed through all the ethanol crap, that ate up a lot of the subsidized food. Foreign aid also eats up a lot as well.

I do think Corn is over subsidized, but the 15B or so of random farm subsidies dont really make a blip on the radar.

As far as global competition , it was there - Germany and Japan mostly.. then South Korea. But you are correct to an extent, China certainly has not been good for us. China has cheated the system, and gotten USA politicians to bend over for it. Clinton and Bush both sold us down the river to China.

And Bush beat Kerry because the GOP literally stole the election, here in Ohio. Its extremely sad.. but the voting system is not even functioning anymore, at least in Ohio.

Also I would like to point some thing that repeat through our human history, "the goat scape factor"

our society as general and some politicians try to pick up scape goat over the course of bad times, I already saw coments from KGB members about the problem of imigrants and blamming them for some degree about the economic problem..

as a remind the nazi blamed the jews about the economic problems,
after the WW2 the comunist were the scape goats and the fuel to many decision taking..

and now the imigrants and muslims as general are the new scape goats for the problems, USA always had people imigranting ilegaly or legaly to work to jobs were less education and qualification were needed, and that was not a factor, now things are getting worse people need something to blame and justify.

Also, lot of taxes on imported food. Hence why your coca cola lost its real taste around '84 '85 (the "new coke" fiasco was organized so Coca Cola could replace its cane sugar by corn sugar).

I don't think that anyone is blaming the immigrants for our economic woes and if they are they are poorly informed at best.

Additionally you should notice that the ground swell of anti-illegalalien sentiment comes from the bottom up. The other two examples you listed came from the top down. If we start to see serious demagoguery from a politician directed at illegals in order to reinforce his/her political power then we should absolutely sit up and pay attention. As it stands now the only time it gets mentioned is when the politician thinks that the audience wants to hear it, but no politician is even seriously talking about immigration reform much less rounding people up. (Never forget that we did the same thing here with Germans in WWI and with Japanese in WWII, thank god we didn't kill them, since what we did do was bad enough [for the record both presidents who rounded up American citizens and immigrants were democrats])

Having said that we do need some serious immigration reform. Being fairly intimately involved with that section of our population I can say without equivocation that it is way too hard for people to come here legally who want to work. If we made it easier for hard working people to come and contribute then we also would make it much easier to single out and find those who wish to do us harm.

Taking money from one class and giving to another IS beating on the socialist drum.


If the Islam shit you're talking about is the video I posted, then I just want to say how shameful it is (the video). Britain has turned into big batch of snatch. We agree on the part of kicking ass as hard and fast as we can, then get out. This means NO EMBEDDED reporters, you want to lose a war or stall it out. Having reporters tag along is a good way to do that. War is hell... PERIOD!

Haliburton did get those contracts, Haliburton is one of the best at what they do. It looked bad, so does Obama Loaning Brazil money for offshore drilling. The company that's going to be doing the drilling is partially owned by George Soros, and a big contributer to Obama's campaign. I didn't hear you raising to much hell over that!


As I said before, GOVERNMENT shouldn't be bailing out ANYONE! Even if it was done by one of our greatest President's ever (Ronald Reagan)
Ford did the right thing, they done what GM should have. When you do nothing except sitting in line waiting on a handout, of course bad things are going to happen if you sit there.



I bought a house in 2000 when I lived in Missouri. I did it not expecting to be approved, I had only three loans in my life at the time. One was my truck loan and the other was a personal loan a few years before that. I never had any credit cards up to that point either. So I was one of those that didn't have enough credit, at least that's what I thought at the time. I was surprised when I got approved. I went in under a First Time Homebuyer. I put down $1,000 and the Government picked up the rest (yeah i know shame on me). Anyway, it was pretty simple to get the loan, there were no snags and as soon as I found a house I was in it pretty quickly. So the whole "it's not that easy" thing must be only a personal experience. Mine is a personel experience, did everyone get it so easy? it seems so with the housing bust. And yes, they also had their arms twisted...
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424...Opinion_LEADTop
That's the link I posted in my earlier post.



Speaking of the ten commandments...
THE SOUTHERN TEN COMMANDMENTS is much easier to remember!!! (1)Just ONE GOD.(2)Put nothin' before GOD. (3)Watch yer mouth.... (4)Git yourself to Sunday meetin'. (5)Honor yer Ma & Pa. (6)No killin'. (7)No foolin' around with another feller's gal (or nother gal's feller). (8)Don't take what ain't yorn. (9)No tellin' tales or gossipin'. (10)Don't be hankerin' for yer buddy's stuff. Now that's plain an' simple. And bless your little cotton pickin heart!!


Oh no, it's Manbearpig. So lets get this out in the open, the earth is how millions of years old? How many of those years were actually recorded with ice core samples,temps...ect.ect? We've also had a few Ice ages... that we know of. Now how can we base 100+ years of records, against something that's millions of years old. Anyway... should we keep trying to do some research & development to be more efficient with less impact on the enviroment? YES... and I'm pretty sure we're doing that. There doesn't need to be an extra government buracracy adding more red tape to know we need to do this. Besides time is running out, we only have until Dec. 21st 11:20 a.m. =P

Obama sux. constantly trying to over tax the american businessman and small business. Were quickly heading into the kracken and we all know how that turns out. I vote turn because i dont really like being fish bait..

And on a side note obama's going to win no matter what because this election was decided by race and will be again. Yes the white americans that voted for him believed his goals and dreams im ok with that but ive yet to meet a black man or woman that voted for him other then because he was black. :-)

Funny stuff Darka, but at this point, as I have said, without a major win that mollifies the people (jobs, economy, some major win that does not deepen the problems) I can honestly say I do not think he has a chance.

That does not mean the replacement will be better, which is frightening considering how pathetically bad Obama is.