The KGB Oracle Forums The KGB Great Hall of History (ARCHIVE) Darkfall Members Forum The Numbers Game

Before I begin, I'd like to express my utmost satisfaction with how the guild has been chugging along. The leadership is active, concerned, and never afraid to answer a question even when swamped in constantly hard-to-navigate Darkfall tell-hell.

One thing I've began to notice, and others have as well, is our lack of numbers when it comes to get-up-n-go sieges. We're lucky to fill one group. Between the factors of not having a good enough computer for sieging, not being online, not having gear, or being so fascinated with clan stone ganking that you can't stop...our numbers are less than breathtaking. The numbers that we do have seem to be the same names every time. I am in no way saying this to bash any member who isn't online enough, or has real life issues preventing them from playing actively. You're not a problem, that's a reality.

I hate recruiting, I really do. I came to KGB based on reputation alone, nobody contacted me. However, I'd like to open a discussion on possible options to improve our lack-luster numbers. Thoughts and opinions, folks?

Syloc and I have been talking about this exact issue a lot lately. Not to bash those who we do have, but how to find a way to SKILLFULLY and with a scalable program to recruit without spam recruiting, being comprimised by spies, and still find quality players to build our numbers upon.

Of course all of this is contingent on there actually being an open store from which to purchase the game, and a server setup that can actually support the player traffic during peak usage of the end game mechanic, which is besieging and the Geopolitical game.

The problem isn't the people we do have, 99.9% of them do what they can, when they can, and bend over backwards for the most part to benefit the greater good of the Clan. You can't ask for much more then that.

As well, as has been stated (and trademarked), "There is no shallow end of the sandbox in Darfkall." Geopolitical espionage is in full swing, as well people who have the game are falling into about one or more of three to four buckets. Either there already in a Clan, or they are total shit bag grievers stuck on a chaos stone with no assets and are only looking to farm the masses, or they are truly new to Darkfall and/or just haven't been interested in the whole global or local PvP/Geopolitics.

The problem is going to be, do we accept poaching on other Clans members as an active way to recruit. If not, and only unguilded members are open to solicitation, this leads you down two roads. Either you Spam recruit on a sliding scale of how aggresivly your going to spam and accept, or you find unguilded members in the noob areas and group up with them and befriend them into joining KGB.

Neither of these in my personal recruiting experience are very enjoyable for the recruiter, and usually the latter option only leads to minimal numbers but a higher average quality of player.

Then you have option 2. The out of game recruiting done via You-Tube and various message boards. I will say this though, you long timers have done your job over the years. KGB's reputation as a quality group of people with which to go beyond a single game is pretty high up there on the tote board. When Syloc approached me about returning with him to KGB for Darkfall, I already knew who KGB was and what you were about, without ever being a member. That fact of quality reputation is going to help us in the short term to garner numbers from out of game recruiting. The problem being is how and in which medium are we going to aggressively pursue this method.

Our lack of numbers is really a combination of a number of factors, paramount of which is the simple fact that our selection process limits on how many we can bring in. This is a good thing, in my honest opinion, and a choice we made from the start, rightly so.

People like to call their guild as original, but in my experience, the best guilds in Shadowbane fell under only two catagories; Zerg or selective. Like it or not, KGB was a zerg in Shadowbane. If you could breath, you could get in, it was as simple as that, and it worked for awhile; however, in all the battles against KGB I'd have back in those days, there was a clear distinction between playing against the core KGB and the fodder KGB. Simple matter-of-fact, KGB core was VERY VERY good, and "no offense" a lot of the rest was VERY VERY bad.

There's no doubt we're going the more "selective" route in DFO; and a route that will pay dividens later down the line, when faced up against the wall, our guild will stand firm while others fall apart.

That being said, Jetstar has been rampantly recruiting good players (dunno how he finds them), and we've been steadily growing through our honorable reputation, good natured ventrillio and our ability to garner good allies. There's no mistake that we need more players, now more than ever - however at the same time, keep being selective on who we choose to let in.

That's why i've been stressing pvp organization more and more, because we've been acting a little like, "We're the shit" in the honest belief that people will come to us because we are pimp, which is something we can't bank on. Lets face it, most of the so-called elite guilds, have turned out to be non-factors in DFO. (WB,UDL,TF,EB,some AC Darktide guilds etc etc) I've always thought that, if we can show strong pvp raiding groups, open field, without always being with allies (like during AC sieges), we can stand out from the rest as we rightly should, and it will appeal more to the newer players that's never heard of KGB.

I'll say one thing though, if the fear is that KGB will disspear into oblivion, put that the fartest from your mind. I firmly believe that we're here the stay, be it as at rebel faction that's fighting the zerg, or that standard which the server looks to at the forefront of every major engagement. Hell, i'm the moron that made my last name deKGB, so I guess i'm stuck with you losers.

We could bring some smaller guilds under our wing and onto the stone to get our active numbers up. Even though there's no 'official' system in DF for fealty, we could do that in DF (I think we already are?). There is no doubt that numbers have meaning. Sure you want all quality pvpers, but when you start to get 3+v1, quantity wins. It's just fact. Same thing in EVE and SB.

I think these 4 main things will bring people:
- Grouping in the newb areas
- Befriending good, smaller guilds to fight with us out of our city (they join our vent, etc)
- Working on our group PvP, raiding, and winning - Other good PvPers are drawn to this (my brother, for example)
- Keeping our name on the boards 'KGB rolled us! We tried to burn KGB's city to the ground and failed!' Publicity brings in people. Gets our name out to those who've not heard of us.

I agree with your first three statements but, to be honest, I disagree with your fourth. I think the fact that we have stayed off the boards is a good thing that garners a better reputation for us than trolling the forums, or "getting our name out".

In my experience, it was those guilds that stayed off the boards, and let their actions do their talking (win or lose) that attracted the best members.

Once we start even posting on the boards, it's only a matter of time before some random guild will flame us because of some random win they had versus us, and we'll be obligated to respond in kind (to set the record straight) and it'll spiral out of control.

I got 3 from an old shadowbane guild Dark Order of Caine apping who wanna join up so there ya go Rep recruiting 3 the rest of you at 0 lets go ! lol

WTF Dark Order of Caine? I was in that guild. Who did you get? Good guys and good templates, but a little flakey at times.

I know they went into DFO, did they dissolve already?

Good topic, good conversation.

Recruiting is a topic leadership struggles with, at least in regards to the how and when and how much.

What I would like to find, is a good recruiter.

All good points, many of which have been said several times, in different ways, by many people.

We are the good guys no ? So let's protect noobz in newbie area. Group with them if they want, guide them and be nice. Groups of 2 or 3 people could be usefull there.

Another thing : don't bitch at unguilded people who attack you. If they're good, start chatting with 'em.