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Re: Radicalization of GOP
Sini #97246 01/09/12 11:34 AM
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Its a general matter of principle. Why are some personal morals OK to impose by force, and others not?

I actually feel no need to revisit any debate, because you do not take part. To have a debate, you have to have at least two sides that acknowledge and respond to what people are actually saying.

For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
Re: Radicalization of GOP
Derid #97307 01/11/12 12:32 AM
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Derid, are you are asking why can one mandate everyone purchasing health insurance but cannot mandate everyone having missionary sex with opposite sex partner within confinement of the institution of marriage.

I just want to make sure I understood question correctly.

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Re: Radicalization of GOP
Sini #97309 01/11/12 01:52 AM
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You know thats not the case, in fact it would be clear if you ever bothered to pay attention to what people said that my position, and the position of rationality are quite different than what you are insinuating.

For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
Re: Radicalization of GOP
Derid #97320 01/11/12 03:53 PM
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Please do elaborate what "some personal morals" you have in mind, and what is or is not or ought to be "impose[d] by force". I want to fully understand your question prior to answering it.

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Re: Radicalization of GOP
JetStar #97326 01/11/12 09:38 PM
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Shaira law, Texas style
Quote:
The Fifth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals on Tuesday upheld a Texas law that requires women seeking an abortion to have a sonogram exam and to listen to a physician's detailed description of the fetus, including whether it has developed limbs or internal organs.


According to the New England Journal of Medicine sonogram prior to abortion is not a medically necessary procedure. Describing the fetus offers no benefit to the patient and has no effect on the outcome. The only purpose of this "procedure" is to be distressing, costly and inconvenient.

The problem is that the legislature required extra steps from the patient with sole intent to discourage the procedure. While they can't outright ban it due to Roe vs Wade, they can make it more complicated, distressing and potentially expensive in hopes of turning more patients away.

This is prime example of evangelical influence is this is why separation of state and church must be enforced at all times.

Physicians and the First Amendment
Quote:
In the November elections, the citizens of three states resoundingly defeated initiatives aimed at curtailing reproductive rights.

The South Dakota law should alarm physicians and the public. If states are permitted to mandate ideological speech about abortion, what is to stop them from doing the same for end-of-life decisions, contraception, stem-cell therapies, vaccination, or any procedure or treatment that does not conform to the political ideology of the statehouse? The doctor–patient relationship is predicated on a foundation of trust. Doctors have an ethical responsibility to provide their patients with accurate medical information. But can a patient trust any interaction with his or her physician knowing that the physician's very words have been mandated by the state?




So much for the small government, so much for respecting the rights of individuals.

Last edited by sinij; 01/11/12 10:17 PM.
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Re: Radicalization of GOP
Sini #97329 01/12/12 02:27 AM
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I was simply pointing out the inconsistency. Lots of people talk about personal freedom, and rejecting other people forcing their own sense of personal morality on them. Then they turn around and try to do the same in regards to other issues.

The point is neither "side" here, if you could even quantify it as such - is consistent with the principle, rather the field is filled with "fair weather friends" of liberty.

" Liberty is good as long as I can do what I want, and as long as other people also do what I want. "

For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
Re: Radicalization of GOP
Derid #97331 01/12/12 11:50 AM
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You are refusing to ask the question, but I will still answer it.

I subscribe to Utilitarianism

Quote:
Utilitarianism is an ethical theory holding that the proper course of action is the one that maximizes the overall "happiness". It is thus a form of consequentialism, meaning that the moral worth of an action is determined only by its resulting outcome, and that one can only weigh the morality of an action after knowing all its consequences.

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Re: Radicalization of GOP
Sini #97335 01/12/12 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted By: sinij
You are refusing to ask the question, but I will still answer it.

I subscribe to Utilitarianism

Quote:
Utilitarianism is an ethical theory holding that the proper course of action is the one that maximizes the overall "happiness". It is thus a form of consequentialism, meaning that the moral worth of an action is determined only by its resulting outcome, and that one can only weigh the morality of an action after knowing all its consequences.


By this logic helping the homeless is immoral.

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Re: Radicalization of GOP
Cheerio #97336 01/12/12 06:06 PM
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I do not follow your logic, what homelessness has to do with Radicalization of GOP, other than where we all going to end up if they ever get back to power.

Last edited by sinij; 01/12/12 06:07 PM.
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Re: Radicalization of GOP
Sini #97342 01/12/12 11:57 PM
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Originally Posted By: sinij
You are refusing to ask the question, but I will still answer it.

I subscribe to Utilitarianism


Pretty sure I had asked that a while ago, thanks for finally answering.

I will say that I find it extremely ironic on many levels.

For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
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