The KGB Oracle Forums General Public Discussion (SPECIAL ACCESS) KGB Political Debate Central I am the 99%...pics

Government does create and destroy jobs. Government creates jobs via defense, education, infrastructure and research spending. Government destroys jobs by creating environment where moving wealth, knowledge and manufacturing to third-world countries for a short-term bottom line gain isn't heavily taxed/discouraged.


Here is example for you:

US technology, that was based on NASA/NH/public education research gets outsourced by a private company to China to save 2% manufacturing costs. Execs get 10 mil bonuses and US lost 1,000 jobs. Private company didn't create this technology in a vacuum. They had access to US educated scientists (GOV money), public research (GOV money) and infrastructure (GOV money) that made that technology possible. So why are they now free to gift this technology to China (that only had to spend fraction of that cost suppressing people to keep labor costs down) while costing jobs at home?!

You should be happy some third world country people got a job and will be able to enjoy a better life.

Remember, even when part of the lowest earner of the Western world, you are a lot richer than 90% of the world population.

Western lifestyle (infrastructure, education, health care) cannot be afforded on third-world salary while living in a Western Nation. Salary-equalization creates situation where you will end up paid salary comparable to Chinese factory worker but have to spend it in a different setting, effectively unable to afford food/health care/shelter.

Richer in absolute terms means nothing; they are richer in relative terms when someone earning 5$ can get $1 healthcare, $1 housing and $1 shelter.

Even someone with access to a shaman in a village 50 miles away is better off than 20-something asthmatic cancer survivor with a student debt and mortgage in default trying to live off Wall-Mart part-time no benefits job.

Once again nobody says we shouldn't help out when things get bad, show me where it was said????

Its the constant taking away the money from one to give to another that creates a welfare nation and a give me what I want because I dont want to work for it Nation that we have seem to become.

It seems that overnight that people think we now have a large population of rich people that don't pay anything in taxes.



"hey had access to US educated scientists (GOV money), public research (GOV money) and infrastructure (GOV money)"

US educated scientists--so all scientist education was paid for by the government? I should have become a scientist if its free.

Public research is Gov money? You know not all research is paid for by the Gov right???

What infrastructure?

That is a direct reflection of the media situation in which people who have never lived here have no real clue, only the bullshit they see in the news and media.

I will never forget in the 1990's when a group of Russian military attended the leadership school where I was an instructor. We took them to a local supermarket and were shocked when they accused us of having set it up , that it could not be real. We had to drive around and show them a whole bunch to prove this was a normal thing in the United States.

Public research is very rarely funded by the government. Us Educated Scientists...why does that have to be government money? And why does the infrastructure have to be government?

This is further evidence of education by media. A lack of understanding.

Government does create jobs, but it has nothing on the potential that the private sector does given little Government involvement via regulation and taxes. What sickens me is when people think the Government the only one that can do all, and that a private sector business is nothing but corruption. Government is corruption. When you have a tax system that is obviously broken and not willing to fix it, but very willing to add more to it is corrupt.

Our politicians only do as much as they can get away with. If we start voting on job performance all of these jackass's will be voted out of office. On the jobs issue, if you can't find a job in your current field then you should look into other fields to find work. It would be grand to be able to find a job in a field you went to college or technical school for. But a job is a job. If that makes me an asshole, who cares.

Too many people look for a handout from the Government, instead of doing a little bit of research and VOTING FOR someone that isn't following their party lines. That is willing to do their JOB and whats best for everyone. Find me a politician that's willing to make big changes with the tax system, to have regulation but not OVER burdened regulation, that believes in social programs to HELP people not to give handouts. I bet you couldn't find more than a few politicians that are willing to do that and be truthful.

There's nothing wrong with protesting. But why are these Wall Street protesters on Wall Street? Wall Street does what they are allowed to do by Government regulation. If companies are making big money because people think they aren't getting taxed fairly, why are they protesting them? They don't make up their own taxes, the Government does. But why are we surprised that it's fucked up, the Chairman of the House Weights and means committee can't figure out how to pay his taxes (See Charlie Rangel) Neither can Geitner, the man that sits at the FED dolling out money unfettered.

I'm still puzzled how you get that we said "We got ours screw your's"We have programs that help people. I personally think the Welfare programs hinders more than it helps. I can agree that if you give someone a trade skill, they can work their way to whatever they want to be or do in their career. With the current economy, it's tough no doubt about it. I was laid off for nearly 2 months but work has picked up in the area I'm skilled in by A LOT. Not sure how you figure we will be working for the same income as a Chinese worker. Last I checked I make in a week what they may in a year. Poor me!

Right now there's a big need for Welders and machinist, where I am. If you want a job, go to your local unemployment office and check with them. I know while I was laid off they were going to train me in other area's after I had been off more than a month. Luckily I was called back, but the opportunity was going to be there to get training through the state in something else. So to sit there and say there is no hope, and the only way they can do anything is to get something FREE from the Government. If that sickens you so be it, if you think the government taking you by the hand telling you when and what you should be doing is the way it should be, well then knock yourself out.

By the way, when the Government gives something it's never free. Tax payers get the bill on that. Bottom line is, if you want fairer taxes then VOTE for someone that's willing to have the balls to stand up and make it happen. Don't just take their word that they want to change, make them give examples and how they intend to fix the tax system. Right now that's a big issue, the economy isn't recovering because companies that have money to invest, won't since the left wants to regulate and tax them into Oblivion. It's not stable, find a fair tax system without regulating them into the dirt and you will find the economy coming back.

Wonder where you really stack up in the 99%? Use this tool built by the Kiplinger Institute to find out just what is what and how upside down our tax code really is.

By the way Helemoto is disproportional income as a ratio to disposiable income that makes a flat National Sales Tax effect the people who make under the 30K threshold more profoundly.

Your $X adjusted gross income (AGI) puts you in the top 25% of earners.

The top-earning 25% of taxpayers reported 65.81% of all AGI and paid 87.30% of total income taxes.

Together, you and the other 34.5 million taxpayers with incomes of $X or more paid a total of $755.9 billion in federal income taxes.