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#114691 - 03/06/13 04:27 PM Re: Climate change! [Re: Derid]  
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I don't see where money could be made being 999th climate scientist supporting overwhelming consensus.

Controversy, if one existed, could enable if not career advances, than at least secure grant money from all proponents. The fact that there is no credible opposition despite all the money poured to oppose it is strong evidence that consensus is right.

Last edited by sini; 03/06/13 04:28 PM.

#114692 - 03/06/13 05:53 PM Re: Climate change! [Re: JetStar]  
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There is actually quite a bit of dissent on climate, just no alternative model. Rather, people are arguing over the degree of accuracy of the popular ones.

The consensus is that the planet is in a warming cycle, but there are still considerable differences between the experts regarding the speed, and reasons. Some people put more emphasis on carbon, some more on methane, some solar, etc.


For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
#114697 - 03/06/13 06:28 PM Re: Climate change! [Re: Derid]  
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Originally Posted By: Derid

There is actually quite a bit of dissent on climate,


Citations please.

Quote:

The consensus is that the planet is in a warming cycle, but there are still considerable differences between the experts regarding the speed, and reasons. Some people put more emphasis on carbon, some more on methane, some solar, etc.


None of them disagree that there is a global warming, and very few argue that there could be a way it is not man-made.

Bottom line - whatever you think about climate science, denying global warming is unscientific.

More practically, even if you think this is God's punishing humanity for sodomy - you better prepare your personal life for increase occurrence of droughts, hurricanes, raising coastlines and inevitable food shortages as some fertile lands stop producing due to these factors.


#114699 - 03/06/13 07:08 PM Re: Climate change! [Re: JetStar]  
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Yeah as I said the planet is in a warming cycle. The differentiation is on how fast, and why.

Arkhs link would actually be a good place to start, plus all the recent articles about volcanoes that have made headlines recently. This is still an evolving science.

Also, dont buy too much into that doom and gloom - those are worst case scenarios. The doom peddling given the state of the predictive models is basically akin to the Mayan Doomsday prophecy at this point.

The El Nino is thought to have an enormous impact on immediate weather patterns for examples, and afaik it is not linked at all to a postulated man made warming cycle.


For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
#114705 - 03/06/13 08:06 PM Re: Climate change! [Re: Derid]  
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Originally Posted By: Derid
Also, dont buy too much into that doom and gloom - those are worst case scenarios.


Actually we are on track to surpass most worst-case scenarios. I am personally anticipating food shortages in ~10 years due to climate change and have money riding on it.


#114710 - 03/07/13 12:32 AM Re: Climate change! [Re: Sini]  
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Originally Posted By: sini
Originally Posted By: Derid

There is actually quite a bit of dissent on climate,


Citations please.

Quote:

The consensus is that the planet is in a warming cycle, but there are still considerable differences between the experts regarding the speed, and reasons. Some people put more emphasis on carbon, some more on methane, some solar, etc.


None of them disagree that there is a global warming, and very few argue that there could be a way it is not man-made.

Bottom line - whatever you think about climate science, denying global warming is unscientific.

More practically, even if you think this is God's punishing humanity for sodomy - you better prepare your personal life for increase occurrence of droughts, hurricanes, raising coastlines and inevitable food shortages as some fertile lands stop producing due to these factors.



“I am a skeptic…Global warming has become a new religion.” – Nobel Prize Winner for Physics, Ivar Giaever

“Since I am no longer affiliated with any organization nor receiving any funding, I can speak quite frankly….As a scientist I remain skeptical.” – Atmospheric Scientist Dr. Joanne Simpson, the first woman in the world to receive a PhD in meteorology and formerly of NASA who has authored more than 190 studies and has been called “among the most preeminent scientists of the last 100 years.”

Warming fears are the “worst scientific scandal in the history…When people come to know what the truth is, they will feel deceived by science and scientists.” – UN IPCC Japanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental physical chemist

“The IPCC has actually become a closed circuit; it doesn’t listen to others. It doesn’t have open minds… I am really amazed that the Nobel Peace Prize has been given on scientifically incorrect conclusions by people who are not geologists,” – Indian geologist Dr. Arun D. Ahluwalia at Punjab University and a board member of the UN-supported International Year of the Planet

“Gore prompted me to start delving into the science again and I quickly found myself solidly in the skeptic camp…Climate models can at best be useful for explaining climate changes after the fact.” – Meteorologist Hajo Smit of Holland, who reversed his belief in man-made warming to become a skeptic, is a former member of the Dutch UN IPCC committee

“Creating an ideology pegged to carbon dioxide is a dangerous nonsense…The present alarm on climate change is an instrument of social control, a pretext for major businesses and political battle. It became an ideology, which is concerning.” – Environmental Scientist Professor Delgado Domingos of Portugal, the founder of the Numerical Weather Forecast group, has more than 150 published articles

Dr Ivan Gjaver, Professor Poly Inst and 1973 Nobel Prize winner, resigned from the APS in utter disgust over the continued junkscience claim that man is causing global warming. He told his colleagues that a mere .6 tenths of a temp increse over 150 years shows a very stable earth temperature(not a warming crisis) and that he will no longer partake of this science fraud


All these Scientist say its naturally caused.
Khabibullo Abdusamatov, mathematician and astronomer at Pulkovo Observatory of the Russian Academy of Sciences[16]
Sallie Baliunas, astronomer, Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics[17][18]
Ian Clark, hydrogeologist, professor, Department of Earth Sciences, University of Ottawa[19]
Chris de Freitas, associate professor, School of Geography, Geology and Environmental Science, University of Auckland[20]
David Douglass, solid-state physicist, professor, Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Rochester[21]
Don Easterbrook, emeritus professor of geology, Western Washington University[22]
William M. Gray, professor emeritus and head of the Tropical Meteorology Project, Department of Atmospheric Science, Colorado State University[23]
William Happer, physicist specializing in optics and spectroscopy, Princeton University[24]
William Kininmonth, meteorologist, former Australian delegate to World Meteorological Organization Commission for Climatology[25]
David Legates, associate professor of geography and director of the Center for Climatic Research, University of Delaware[26]
Tad Murty, oceanographer; adjunct professor, Departments of Civil Engineering and Earth Sciences, University of Ottawa[27]
Tim Patterson, paleoclimatologist and professor of geology at Carleton University in Canada.[28][29]
Ian Plimer, professor emeritus of Mining Geology, the University of Adelaide.[30]
Nicola Scafetta, research scientist in the physics department at Duke University[31][32]
Tom Segalstad, head of the Geology Museum at the University of Oslo[33]
Fred Singer, professor emeritus of environmental sciences at the University of Virginia[34][35][36]
Willie Soon, astrophysicist, Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics[37]
Roy Spencer, principal research scientist, University of Alabama in Huntsville[38]
Henrik Svensmark, Danish National Space Center[39]


All these Scientist say not enough is known to say what causes it.
Syun-Ichi Akasofu, retired professor of geophysics and founding director of the International Arctic Research Center of the University of Alaska Fairbanks[41]
Claude Allègre, politician; geochemist, Institute of Geophysics (Paris)[42]
Robert C. Balling, Jr., a professor of geography at Arizona State University[43]
John Christy, professor of atmospheric science and director of the Earth System Science Center at the University of Alabama in Huntsville, contributor to several IPCC[44][45]
Petr Chylek, space and remote sensing sciences researcher, Los Alamos National Laboratory[46]
Judith Curry, chair of the School of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences at the Georgia Institute of Technology[47]
David Deming, geology professor at the University of Oklahoma[48]
Antonino Zichichi, emeritus professor of nuclear physics at the University of Bologna and president of the World Federation of Scientists



I can keep going on, but as we all know Sini will just say they are not proper scientist or some such bullshit because it doesn't fit in his view point.

My point is, yes the the climate of the earth changes, by what sini and the rest of the crazies ssy humans must have been around for 4 billion years to cause the constant cooling and heating of the earth.
I guess I don't get the argument that only humans are changing the climate.
I personally don't believe we are even remotely smart enough to know.


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#114711 - 03/07/13 12:37 AM Re: Climate change! [Re: Sini]  
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Originally Posted By: sini
Originally Posted By: Derid
Also, dont buy too much into that doom and gloom - those are worst case scenarios.


Actually we are on track to surpass most worst-case scenarios. I am personally anticipating food shortages in ~10 years due to climate change and have money riding on it.


So you are personally are so smart you know that the slight change in temp will cause the starvation of millions,
not only that it will be the doom and gloom, you are so smart you absolutely know that it could not cause good for the planet,
you know for a fact it is death to millions and you are betting on it?


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#114715 - 03/07/13 02:39 AM Re: Climate change! [Re: Helemoto]  
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My ability to understand world around me and profit from this knowledge served me well so far. I won't imagine to tell you what to do, but if you are living in coastal or flood zones, taking a page out of preparers book would be a prudent course of action.

Oh, and US won't starve. We will end up paying close to ~20% of income for food by 2040, but we will be OK.


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