The KGB Oracle Forums General Public Discussion (SPECIAL ACCESS) KGB Political Debate Central Probably the dumbest thing possible...

He was not saying you were Mithus, he was trying to tell you that like so many others who were duped by the liberal media into believing that NO weapons of mass destruction existed were fooled by a dishonest media. There were obviously weapons of mass destruction, since we know he used them on his own people before all of US involvement.

Saddam didnt have WMD to hand, and even if he did so what? There was also no reason to believe he would use them against the USA. He was more worried about Iran.

So, 100k+ dead Iraqi civilians, trillions of dollars and thousands of US servicemen lives lost later... we have effectively handed control of Iraq to Iran.

I can even be found on record here on the Oracle before the war even started saying what a retarded idea it was, that there were likely no or few WMDs, that tens of thousands would die ( more died than even I thought) and that Iran would be the beneficiary when we left. I also predicted that we would not be hailed as great liberators, and that Iraq would be a shit hole for the foreseeable future.

A great genius is not and was not required to reach those conclusions, they were all patently obvious when the drums of war started to be beaten. Then and now.

Now the war drums are starting to beat regarding Iran... and it makes me very worried.

This is exactly right.

I wasn't making a comment on the validity of our invasion of Iraq. I was merely pointing out that rebutting the WMD claim is silly. Make the case against the invasion. I'll likely back you, but just don't pull out the "no WMDs" line because its wrong.



Sans the first sentence, this too is exactly right. It is not hard at all to make the case that our opportunist government saw an opening, while we were in Afghanistan, to go into Iraq to try to make the region where much of our fuel comes from more secure. Bad move. The problem with trying to "free a people" is the same problem with government hand outs. If a person doesn't have to work for something, typically they don't appreciate it nearly as much as the guy who did work for it. The folks in Iraq do not appreciate the "gift" they've been given because, by in large, they were/are not ready for it. A people has to be completely oppressed and willing to sacrifice their own lives to rise up and do something about it before any sort of beneficial reform can happen i.e. our founding fathers. The simple truth is most of the populace in Iraq wasn't ready for that, and since Iran has had their sights set on certain parts of Iraq for the better part of a century, they will take the opportunity (just like we did) to take it as soon as its politically/militarily convenient. They are obviously planning something fairly soon or they wouldn't be sending warships to hang out around Cuba...

ps. I didnt take personaly any disqualifying comment.

You guys were too much brainwashed by propaganda, is a waste of time arguing

It's not difficult to just follow the comment, lets take advantage of 9/11 fear on population and attack Iraqi, we do not like Saddam that controls too much oil and oil has too much strategic importance, lets take them out and put someone that is aligned with USA, the rest is rest...

The part about the most invaded country. Coming from people living in a 300 year old country stolen from some savages makes me laugh.


They get a salary and their job is to kill people. So anyway your sugar-coat it, they are hired killers.
I'm just saying it at the level of "Manning leaked top secret document so he is a traitor".



I don't.
But I know that history is written by the victors: what for us are terrorists is for some other members of the Resistance. I think the best way to fight terrorism is not by invading random countries by force, but invading by your culture: get them education and the means to get out of the shit they are in so they can enjoy the western lifestyle in two or three generations and terrorism won't be a problem. Have we got any indian, brazilian, chinese or taiwanese terrorist bomber for the past 30 years? That's because their nations are driven by the perspective of progress instead of jealousy.

History is indeed written by the victors and the actions which brought them victory. There is only one way to fight terrorism, and radical religion. Excise it. You are dealing with a culture which is 400 years behind. AND MANY who have been there will tell you, no matter all the education in the world, they do not wannt to change. Do I think it would have been better to have stayed out, yes. I said when we went to Afghanistan it was a bad move, not because it was a wrong move, but because the culture and ideology was such that we were in for a long, brutal and costly fight. To tack Iraq onto that was foolish. If I had my way, Afghanistan would be that glass parking lot I spoke of. And you would look in horror and be shocked at the death of so many innocents. And as was the case with every country France fought in its empire days, there are no innocents, only future antagonists. The only way to deal with terrorists is to ensure they understand that actions taken by them will result in far worse repercussions. You can not replace their ideology in a school house. They bomb an embassy, take out a city. It's that simple. You will have to educate me, I have never heard of a Chinese or Taiwanese terrorist. I know that there are plenty of muslim cells in indonesia perhaps? Not sure.

Good!

Exactly!

"The part about the most invaded country. Coming from people living in a 300 year old country stolen from some savages makes me laugh"

Stolen from the savages from countrys like Spain,France,Italy.........

Dont forget all countrys were stolen at one time from savages.

/poor gasoline

In point of fact, where I live now in southern Louisiana many of the folks who live here still speak a bastardized version of French.

Yes, but that section of the country was not "stolen" from the French, they sold it to the United States in the Louisiana Purchase, which pretty much covererd much of the midwest.