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I never said they are responsible for providing anything, try getting insurance with a pre-existing condition or talk to some one about fairness when they suddenly don't have coverage when they get cancer or some other horrible illness. What about those who have to pay med. bills or for medication or utility bills or food or their house or car, no I a not saying free rides for all. Have you looked at the cost of insurance? It is not affordable for everyone. Hell the Pres. wanted people to be able to buy into Medicaid, it was part of the Health Reform Bill, Republicans said no. The reason, you tell me??

We all know the health care was not going to be free Right????

You were going to have to pay for it or pay a fine for not having it.

I knew.

Actually, this right here pretty much says that you think insurance companies are responsible for taking care of people who haven't paid them anything.

I hate to break the news to you, because apparently no one ever has, but life isn't fair and you're not guaranteed anything other than that you will eventually die.

Just remember in your rage about how it's not owed to anyone that you save a little compassion for your fellow man. A few wrong bad decisions and that could be you praying for and needing a little help. However much of the problem is their own fault, I promise you they never said as a kid I want to grow up and be poor, be homeless, or be a drug addict. To those whom have made it big and lend a helping hand to the less fortunate, I salute you. But to those that think tough shit I got mine why should I help you, I think you should evaluate your soul. Capitolism without compassion is just a bunch of greedy bastards, and will collapse.

You're on the right path but you've assigned the responsibility to the wrong people. Individuals should act with compassion, not groups.

When a group attempts to act compassionately it leads to compulsory "charity," corruption, greed and the desire for power.

When an individual acts out of compassion it is laudable, good, and admirable. It leads to a sense of fulfillment, and helps others to understand the responsibility of their situations. It affords the individual the opportunity to actually help a person in need, rather than anonymously throw money at the situation via a third party, like the government. That is the definition of generosity.

If anyone has misinterpreted my words in such a way as to lead them to believe that I don't act charitably with my money, time and efforts in my personal life, then they are reading something into my words that doesn't exist there.

For many people, especially in the society we've created, it is very difficult to separate individual action from the action of the government on "behalf of the individual." If you cannot currently do this, then making the effort to see the difference is paramount if you're going to be able to read my words, and the words of other like-minded citizens of this country, without being offended or assuming that I'm heartless or uncaring. Nothing could be further from the truth and I could easily line up dozens of people to testify to that for you. Several of which are members of this community.

My efforts in threads like this one are simply to help people understand what I intuitively (or maybe as a product of my upbringing) understand. The simple fact that when charity isn't done personally it ceases to be charity. It becomes an onerous and resented task (like paying taxes). You lose all sense of responsibility for HOW your money is used for the benefit of others, and most of all you lose the sense of accomplishment and fulfillment that you gain when you personally help some one, not just to pay a bill or buy some food, but help them find a way to help themselves. It is the height of selfish conceit to assume that others are not capable of doing the things that you do to earn money. The money that affords you the opportunity to do for others what you would hope someone would do for you if you were in a bad situation. How can someone claim its charity to deprive someone of the same opportunities they have?

That is exactly what social justice programs do. They don't teach people how to improve their lives, they only teach people the lie that something can be had for nothing. That you're owed something simply for being born. If someone is taught that from birth, what incentive will they ever have to achieve something greater than they are? What will motivate them to want to be better? What if one of those ghetto kids would have cured cancer, but because he never had to work for anything in his life, he never wanted to try harder, never wanted to excel at something, never wanted to be the best, and instead of working hard, going to med school and curing cancer, he just married the girl he knocked up and spent the rest of his life collecting a check from "those greedy rich people." Who, by the way, did work hard, did want something better for themselves, and they got off their asses, and they went out and GOT IT!

This may seem to be a bit off topic but the social medicine programs that started this conversation are part of the same problem. You cannot address one independent of the other. Until we realize that the problems are systemic and pervasive through our entire social/governmental structure, we cannot act effectively to fix them.

Ultimately what it boils down to is that some of us think that if we were allowed to use our money (effort and time) as we see fit then it would have a much greater impact than the government's use of said money.

The other side of the argument believes (and I think this is perverted logic at best) that they are the epitome of charity in their advocacy for the government to take from one and give to another. What they seem to believe is that they are charitable but the rest of humanity is greedy and selfish and left to their own devises would never help anyone. If you really believe that everyone but you is selfish, why would you want to help them? And that, in my opinion, is the primary flaw in that line of reasoning. In order to want to help others you must first have a sincere belief in the redemptive quality of your fellow man. But since that sincere belief logically leads to my side of the argument, I'm forced to realize that many folks who are claiming to be charitable, by advocating for wealth redistribution, either have a nefarious reason for doing so, or only want to be SEEN as charitable and giving. The desire for perceived charity over actual charity, in my opinion is one of the definitions of evil.

Will work for mmo

Stop sounding like a broken record. Insurance companies should provide insurance at a fair price & fair conditions. Yes the world isn't fair, but why should that be a excuse for a business not to be, their is a difference between a business & the Mafia/mob.



I never put that. Lets all look at this good What about those who aren't lazy? The health insurance companies didn't lift a finger to provide health insurance to peopke,

Ok I misspelled people, but I don't see free or anything that means free.



So all that just to say I believe everyone is selfish, so thanks for rubber stamping me that way. I gave $100 to the help for Haiti charity. I hope you or your loved ones never get horribly sick, or have to pay for meds./med. bills or the house/food/car/utilities. Why can't someone get health insurance for $350ish instead of $1,000+

About group charity, in France almost everything is handled by the gov'. So a lot of people thinks that "well, I'm paying enough taxes, so I help those enough already".
And we are the nation which eats the most anti-depressors per year.
If you follow some theory about oxytocin saying that it's released by your brain as a reward when you help people the anti depressor shit would be explained.

Wanna help people ? Do it yourself with your time, your effort or your money. Not those of other people.

If, "didn't lift a finger to help" those people who aren't paying them doesn't mean free then I'm afraid you and I have completely different understandings of the English language.

I don't know where you're getting your figures but I currently pay about $250 per month for outstanding medical coverage from Cigna. I used to have BCBS and they were just as good. If you're paying more than that, perhaps you should shop around...

I've had loved ones get sick. I've watched people I love waste away and die. It is sad, it is tragic and its something that takes years to recover from. Please stop throwing the "I hope you never..." line at me as though I've never had friends or family get sick and die. Every time you do that it makes me want to respond with "Fuck you, don't talk to me." If you want to continue with the veiled personal assaults and passive aggressive taunts, I'll be glad to exit stage left and let you fight with yourself. I thought we were engaging in a debate of ideas, but you don't seem to have any. Each of your posts is a rehashing of the "its not fair, some one should pay for my stuff" argument, if you can call it that.

Clearly I'm not getting through to you Salohcin. I'm sorry that I'm not intelligent enough to help you understand my point. I hope that someday you meet someone who is.