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#139015 - 11/22/16 03:59 PM Re: Trump card [Re: Sini]  
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Derid Offline
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So, who gets to decide which news is "real" and which isn't?


For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
#139016 - 11/22/16 04:11 PM Re: Trump card [Re: Sini]  
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Quote:
Conservative Kansans fall for a plutocratic, imperialist agenda cloaked in patriotism, religion, and nostalgia for the good old Ed Sullivan days; liberal New Yorkers fall for the same plutocratic, imperialist agenda dressed up in multiculturalism, identity politics, and celebration of the good new Caitlin Jenner days. Who’s the bigger fool? How’s that working out for everybody? For the millions of victims of that top-down, plutocratic class war — in the ghettos of the cities and the hollows of Appalachia? For the Syrians, Iraqis, and Libyans, whose countries have been destroyed? Ad infinitum.

Yes, the voters who switched from Barack to Donald are fools for thinking that Trump is going to help them in any way, but they are not fools for thinking that Hillary Clinton would not have.

And how smart or foolish is it to think the thing to do now is to try and persuade them on the next version of Hillary, Clinton 3.0 (Obama was 2.0)—which is all the Democratic Party is going to offer them. This bouncing back and forth between phony, mendacious saviors—from "hope and change" to "make America great again"—while ignoring, or posing false solutions to, the fundamental socio-economic forces ripping the country apart, is the characteristic of American liberal-conservative, Democratic-Republican, politics. It suffers a lot of fools.


From http://www.thepolemicist.net/2016/11/ship-of-fools-what-trump-teaches.html

Which btw is a blog I think Arkh originally found. I don't agree with everything in the post, but there are some good points made.


For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
#139017 - 11/22/16 05:38 PM Re: Trump card [Re: Derid]  
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Originally Posted By: Derid
So, who gets to decide which news is "real" and which isn't?


I see your point, but in reality, the slippery slope is a few miles away from the Pope endorsing Donald Trump.


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#139018 - 11/22/16 06:44 PM Re: Trump card [Re: rhaikh]  
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Originally Posted By: rhaikh
Originally Posted By: Derid
So, who gets to decide which news is "real" and which isn't?


I see your point, but in reality, the slippery slope is a few miles away from the Pope endorsing Donald Trump.


If people really believe that, then that is a problem that can't be fixed by having someone censor that particular blurb. Trying to do so is simply focusing on the wrong problem, much like trying to eliminate the electoral college and go to popular vote.

In any case, I genuinely think that Facebook and similar platforms are harbingers of doom for a society that wants to maintain democratic roots. Facebook is the "new TV" in that if you want to maintain a rational outlook, and an even disposition, you shouldn't get your news or opinion from it - or probably use it at all. I cannot help but wonder if the complete loss of rationality by the self-identifying left, and right, isn't magnified by Facebook and its ilk. Humans aren't cognitively wired to be well-adjusted when immersed in that type of social environment, nor have we any type of socialized immunity to groupthink or epistemic isolationism.

There are of course, individual exceptions. By and large, my fears regarding "social media" have proven true over the years. But that's another topic.


For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
#139020 - 11/22/16 08:59 PM Re: Trump card [Re: Sini]  
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Note how the "fake news" problem appeared suddenly in all the traditional media at the same time.

That's propaganda pure and simple. Those fuckers coordinated to try and get out of their own responsibility. THEY are the dealers of fake news under the guise of their old good reputation. They colluded with candidates and politicos. They have email lists to do those kind of things together. They push narratives. So-called journalists and their editors fucked up journalism in the eyes of everyone but themselves, those elections were part of the consequence. Their dwindling revenues are another.

Fuck them.

Want to know when the 4th estate failed? See when 95% of the population would not piss on them if they were burning. The 4th power is now just a mouthpiece for state propaganda like in any banana republic. Give it ten more years and you'll get the same shit we have in Europe with all media depending on the money coming from the state. With prominent journos married to politicians. And they'll still try to sell how independent and anti-establishment they are.



#139021 - 11/23/16 01:39 AM Re: Trump card [Re: Sini]  
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For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
#139077 - 11/28/16 07:07 PM Re: Trump card [Re: Sini]  
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I always laughed at the right's assertions that media is rigged against them. Turns out, they are partially right. Where they went wrong with the complaint is assuming it is against them, rather than pro-establishment of either type.

Media failed us informing that Trump is popular, media failing help us understanding why he succeeded, and media is now peddling solution that censorship is the right solution to this problem.


#139080 - 11/28/16 08:52 PM Re: Trump card [Re: Sini]  
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It's not that the media failed to inform us that Trump was popular, but rather that the media chose sides, and at every turn sought to push the narrative of Hillary's inevitability. If that isn't a rigged situation, I don't know what is.


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#139083 - 11/28/16 09:13 PM Re: Trump card [Re: Sini]  
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Well, yeah. I've always maintained that mainstream media is an establishment organ, as opposed to an ideological one. There are examples of exceptions to the general rule, and maybe I picked a bone at some point for the sake of entertainment - and there is a bit of implicit bias due to education/background. But for the most part the writers/pundits cater to the perceived agendas of their editors/producers, who cater to the agenda of the VPs, who cater to the perceived (or at this level, flatly stated)agenda of the CEO and various powerful board members.

There are usually "layers" so it isn't as if the people in the trenches are being told what to write, exactly. (Though there are exception, like Faux News channel where Murdoch and Aisles both did literally have a red line direct to the production room, where guests that said the wrong things would be summarily dismissed/cut off) But if they want to write/say something useful they usually won't get a budget to do so (even NYT writers that do real investigative journalism usually do so in the form of an outside book deal.)

By the same token, if say, some folks in the "trenches" at say, CBS, did do something like say, a real expose on quantitative easing cash flow and how it helped empower the most corrupt elements of Wall St to put an even greater stranglehold on the economy - expect heads to roll.

This has always been obvious, and after the previous election cycle, should hopefully be obvious to more people. Mainstream media in the US is pretty much garbage, despite occasionally (very rarely these days,) doing something meaningful.


For who could be free when every other man's humour might domineer over him? - John Locke (2nd Treatise, sect 57)
#139084 - 11/28/16 09:15 PM Re: Trump card [Re: Sini]  
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Maybe if they were to cater to the needs of their audience, they might be held in less contempt.


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